Gosh Chess, that's a touching point of view. I commend you for such insight. It reminded me of something I once read. Reality, the other story
The idea above is interesting. The only problem is that you can't get most of them (convicts) to do ANYTHING that does not benefit them in some way. The nature of the sociopath is "service to self." You might get them to work a little if you kept mounted guards with bullwhips nearby. Then the "cruel and unusual" people start crying. I believe in swift and severe punishment. I do not like to see people locked up for long periods of time. I think 30 days in an non air conditioned isolation cell eating bread and water is a far superior punishment to 5 years of leisure in a prison. I also like supervised probation with quick consequences for violations. I also really like tazers, tear gas, and attack dogs, so I doubt that my opinion will ever be valued. PS - I further think sex offenders should have their penis surgically removed. Does a murder get to keep his gun? I think not. So why should a rapist get to keep his "gun?" :shock: Barry
The prisons have become a housing facility for some of the worst society has to offer. It has proven to be an ineffective deterrent to crime. If one cannot be trusted to home confinement, then his value as a human being in todays global market place where he can't be employed, is worthless. We can no longer deny the 'working poor' access to health care, while inmates are entitled to it. Would you hire a thug who has spent much of his young life behind bars and his only skill is kicking your ass. Not me. It is in the best interest of all citizens of a free society to be on your best behavior. My resolution to this problem may not be obvious to some, but like I said, prisons don't work.
I don't believe in violence or punishment, even punishment of a superior kind. The sociopath in my idea wouldn't eat if he didn't work, to service his need of self he would have to work to meet his basic needs of survival. I still think that people of this nature, can be useful and productive to a civil society with the appropriate controls and processes in place. Violence is the first refuge of the weak, all punishment is cruel ask the people being punished if it's fair or just. In regards to sex offenders have you ever worked with any of them? What is your opinion on how that vicious circle gets started? Is their a way to get to the root of the problem without employing barbaric techniques by mutilating another human being in a quest for justice?
lalala this is to all the people that like to TALK before getting INFROMED, especially to hank who tries to appear witty yet looks stupid every single time....... it DOES cost more to execute someone because of the appeals process, it's fucking endless...... imagine what a lawyer bill of 20 years looks like....... on the other hand people say why don’t we just take them out back and shoot them as soon as they're found guilty? because the system isn't infallible, and to kill an innocent person so you can save on taxes seems to be something only a VERY ignorant individual could think of..... look i'm not defending dude, what he did is terrible and he is a menace to society.... but he's been negotiating truces between gangs that have doubtlessly saved lives..... so he may still be worth something to society.... he sure as hell isn't worth anything dead, too late now
Society does'nt need truces between gangs, society needs to be rid of gangs. I submit that if you want to sponsor a criminal in the manner to which he is accustomed, then you do so. The rest of us taxpayers have no further use for them.
hank once again you astound me.... you appear to live in a world of black and white.... must be very easy for you to know who is guily and who is innocent.... truly.... the world does not need truices between gangs? how about countries? your mind seems only to comprehend whats directly infront and never the ramifications on a greater scale.... do we need criminals gone YES...... who is a criminal? if you steal cable are you a criminal? what if u buy a stolen TV from a crackhead? if you don't report your alcoholic friend for beating up on his girlfriend? truly hank you yourself were a teenager.... remember how easy it was to fall in with the wrong crowd... your friends that did.... are they beyond rehabilitation?
Many years ago we had a justice system here in the US that was inadequate, to say the least. Wealth, popularity, crooked judges, etc, could buy justice. People came to realize that the only way to get justice was to take it upon themselves to do the deed. Lynch mobs were not uncommon. More often than not, they hanged the wrong one. Todays judicial system is looking much the same as it did then. Wealth, influence, popularity seem to take justice away from the victims. You may have seen all the attention that Stanley Tookie Williams received, how everyone cried pleaded for his life. That is good. It gives life value. He died surrounded by friends, supporters, his family and the media. He died peacefully. His victims did not. They died horribly. The death sentence is too expensive. The appeals process was intended to afford a convicted person a chance to prove his innocence, not play the system for a quarter of a century. It was not meant to redeem. The sentence should have been carried out 25 years ago. Last night the judicial system may very well have killed a man who was "redeemed". In 25 years you are hardly the person that you once were. The judicial systems liberal policies in the state of California have failed Tookie Williams, his family, the victims and their families and the people of the state of California. When the judicial system doesn't work, people tend to take things in their own hands.
is the post above not contradictory to your earlier reply where you said his most significant contribution to society will be his death? there is the exact same topic in the cold sober pages.... what i posted there has much bearing on your comment about inequality, the thing about inequality is that people dont usually form lynch mobs if it's working in their favor..... the minorities end up getting the thick splintery shaft and can't say much about it because they dont have a voice once again i do not know weather this man should have lived or died..... that choice has been made i only choose to challenge the opinions of those people who have made them without knowing as much as they possibly can
According to the law, he should have and did die. However, in my opinion he should have died 25 years ago, when it was tried in a court of law, instead of a court of public opinion. To place his ultimate fate in the hands of the Governor, whose political life also depends on his decision to grant clemency or not, is also questionable. If he grants clemency, then his political life is over. Tookie Williams' fate was decided 25 years ago, it was carried out last night. They did not kill the Tookie Williams who had just killed four people. That Tookie Williams escaped justice. The Tookie Williams that died last night, paid for the crimes of his youth. The debt is paid.
you do make a valid point at the end..... but had they killed him 25 years ago that would mean that they' be killing everyone convicted of the death penalty the day after their conviction.... which by now would have left a lot of innocent people dead when you say the debt is paid i can only perhaps understand that it is paid to the families of the victims who may find some peace in his passing.... but his debt to society has not been paid....... intentionally or not did help create one of the worst plagues to ever hit urban youth..... a plague that still to this day exists and spreads, he owes it to society to rectify that mistake..... he was still a powerful icon for that organization and could have done much good to help eradicate that most vicious syndicate..... but now he is lost, we just threw one of our most powerful tool for the rehabilitation of gang members away for revenge
My point exactly, everyone lost. His actions caused a great many people grief, confusion over what is right or wrong, and a sense of loss. If nothing else, a lesson can be learned from this. When you murder someone, you affect more than the lives of yourself and your victim. It affects us all. A society must have laws, and they must be absolute. They are often unfair, but as of yet, it's the best we've got. Good night, smiles.
Who really gives fuck what Hank says? It's all nonsensical garbage that has no source besides the decrepit mind that creates it. Reality has no bearing on it's arguments. I am conviced it does not know what it's thinking itself.
You know, i have to agree, especially with the last sentence. I mean, it just flipped from a ridiculous OTT show of hysterical hyena-esque laughter to a mature, contemplative 'voice of reason'. Everything it does is just an act. Then again, it is a black man who likes to dress itself up as a white woman, so why should we be surprised?
What about other laws, for example the ones which forbid going and gratuitously smashing up a country which posed no imminent threat to anybody, destroying their culture and (modern and ancient) history, murdering, torturing, maiming, humiliating and generally terrorising millions, stealing its wealth and shafting it from every direction imaginable (or genocide as it's sometimes known)...laws which in order to benefit humanity must be absolute, and although not perfect, the best we've got...err...had. What about them?
